styrofoam as fiberglass mold, is it possible?

[JJCE]

just came to my mind this morning. pwede kaya ito? then i realized that the resin can melt the styrofoam just like the rugby does. pwede kayang lagyan ng foil, o tape kaya? nabasa ko din latex paint daw? uubra ba yun? haven't tried anything fiberglass but i already read some articles about it (including here and tsikot.com) then i thought it would be interesting ;D tia.

[spyghost]

just came to my mind this morning. pwede kaya ito? then i realized that the resin can melt the styrofoam just like the rugby does. pwede kayang lagyan ng foil, o tape kaya? nabasa ko din latex paint daw? uubra ba yun? haven't tried anything fiberglass but i already read some articles about it (including here and tsikot.com) then i thought it would be interesting ;D tia.

polyester resin aka per will melt ordinary styro. you can use polyurethane styro if you want direct contact with resin. there is also a product known as styro-skin which is like a white paste you brush on to styro making a surface that can be moldable and glassed.

diluted glue will also work, but not as moldable as styro skin. the same goes for latex paint. babarahan kasi nila yung sandpaper pag kiniskis kahit tuyong tuyo. what more if wet sanded. btw, the latex specifically used here should be the water based one.

btw, the per, styroskin and polyglue can be bought at polymerprod philippines

[bbn]

If you use laminating epoxy instead of polyester you can use styrofoam no problem. I'd still fill the styro with putty though because epoxy is a lot more expensive than polyester. Using epoxy will make whatever you are making a lot lot stronger, and epoxy is a lot easier to use than polyester.

[JJCE]

how about wrapping it around with masking tape?

i'm thinking of making a fiberglass snorkel (for a 4x4) out of my curiosity lang. and i thought a snorkel would be a nice project. though i do not know when will i materialize my dream. :-[ dahil snorkel, it is an enclosed product..kaya i'm thinking im going to do 2 pieces then stick it together afterwards.

btw i've got a bit OT question. is it true that FG gives out "powder" dusty substances over time?

another, kung ang gagawin kong mold e same structure lang sa snorkel itself, paano ma smosmoothen ang outside (exposed) part nya? hindi ba parang mag aappear yan na mabuhok? (dahil sa fibers) at yung area na naka dikit sa mold un ang smooth? :confused:

[JJCE]

BTW, another question, roughly how much ang /kilogram ng fiberglass fiber? at ng polyester resin, gelcoat, hardener at kung ano pa kailangan... tia :)

[bbn]

Sorry Bro I've no idea how much polyester resin costs but it is a lot less than epoxy. Fiberglass costs around P200/kg.

The powder is probably because there was not UV inhibitor added.

Snorkel - nice project.

[spyghost]

BTW, another question, roughly how much ang /kilogram ng fiberglass fiber? at ng polyester resin, gelcoat, hardener at kung ano pa kailangan... tia :)

take a look here: http://www.polymerprod.com/

there are many kinds of fg. the most common, csm, which iirc is around 150/kg. per is 120/kg, hardener is 75/bottle, epoxy resin is 1300/gal. i can't remember price of gelcoat. btw, you'll also need cobalt accelerator for the gelcoat.

[spyghost]

how about wrapping it around with masking tape?

possible also. i did this once. i created a plug (mold) out of a carboard wrapped in masking tape and grocery bag. but it still depends on the form of what you'll do.


i'm thinking of making a fiberglass snorkel (for a 4x4) out of my curiosity lang. and i thought a snorkel would be a nice project. though i do not know when will i materialize my dream. :-[ dahil snorkel, it is an enclosed product..kaya i'm thinking im going to do 2 pieces then stick it together afterwards.

for cylindrical, tube, or anything that is of a similar form, you can also do it as a whole and not 2 pieces stuck together.

the procedure would be a bit more complex that you think. if i were to do it, what i am going to do is carve a the form that i want to in styro, as what you have in mind, then glass it over - a layer or two will do. give it a mirror finish. next is i'll "flange" the plug such that i'll be able to do two pieces of the mold. once you've created the two molds, you can now join those two together and lay glass inside. in this way, whole na yung tube ng snorkel.


btw i've got a bit OT question. is it true that FG gives out "powder" dusty substances over time?

another, kung ang gagawin kong mold e same structure lang sa snorkel itself, paano ma smosmoothen ang outside (exposed) part nya? hindi ba parang mag aappear yan na mabuhok? (dahil sa fibers) at yung area na naka dikit sa mold un ang smooth? :confused:

kung tama ang timpla ng resin at saturation ng fibers, hindi sya magiging mabuhok. proper resin prep and fiber saturation is the key. as for the dust, i never had this problem. it might be only a cleaning factor.

as for the finishing, a lot use body filer to fill the gaps, but i suggest using fiber fill or milled fibers to fill the high spots. just use the body filler (masilya) for minor filling purposes.

[bbn]

Epoxy is now P1790 per gal.

[spyghost]

If you use laminating epoxy instead of polyester you can use styrofoam no problem. I'd still fill the styro with putty though because epoxy is a lot more expensive than polyester. Using epoxy will make whatever you are making a lot lot stronger, and epoxy is a lot easier to use than polyester.

this is true, laminating epoxy won't melt styro. i'm not sure with putty though. what's good about epoxy also is the long working time (4 hours iirc) unlike per na 20-25 mins lang.

[bbn]

Bro, "baliktad". Epoxy has a working time of about 45 minutes. Polyester takes a couple of hours. I've never used polyester but I would like to one of these days.

[JJCE]

thank you guys im getting a bunch of inspirations already hehehe :D

ngek mahal pala ang polyester resin? pwede bang makabili nyan ng less than a galon? siguro marami na ang isang kilo ng FG dba, magaan lang yun e.. ilang kilo kaya kailangan ko para sa dream project ko?

@spyghost, thanks sa suggestions. so meaning, hahatihin ko in half ang mold? (with the glass already)? then i join in one pagkatapos?
ganyan din idea ko, minimal use of masilya lang to minimize the weight as possible. hmmm cobalt accelerator pa dn pala..

sa timpla lang pala yun ng resin at saturation ng fibers..i also assume you would also to sand down to make it even..

i think i need to do a research about the kinds of FGs first at para malaman ko kung ano ang pinaka suitable para project ko..

i also read about wrapping foil around the plug to protect its texture.. and masking tape to hold it in place.. :)

[JJCE]

Sorry Bro I've no idea how much polyester resin costs but it is a lot less than epoxy. Fiberglass costs around P200/kg.

The powder is probably because there was not UV inhibitor added.

Snorkel - nice project.

i assume UV inhibitor is needed to be applied on projects that are exposed to sunlight most of the time? pineprevent ba nito ang deterioration ng surface? pati ang sa inner part?

[spyghost]

thank you guys im getting a bunch of inspirations already hehehe :D

ngek mahal pala ang polyester resin? pwede bang makabili nyan ng less than a galon? siguro marami na ang isang kilo ng FG dba, magaan lang yun e.. ilang kilo kaya kailangan ko para sa dream project ko?

@spyghost, thanks sa suggestions. so meaning, hahatihin ko in half ang mold? (with the glass already)? then i join in one pagkatapos?
ganyan din idea ko, minimal use of masilya lang to minimize the weight as possible. hmmm cobalt accelerator pa dn pala..

sa timpla lang pala yun ng resin at saturation ng fibers..i also assume you would also to sand down to make it even..

i think i need to do a research about the kinds of FGs first at para malaman ko kung ano ang pinaka suitable para project ko..

i also read about wrapping foil around the plug to protect its texture.. and masking tape to hold it in place.. :)

the polyester resin that i was using was the general purpose premixed one r10-103. i only buy per kg. iirc its around 150/kg. ang lalagyan nya is parang bote ng toyo. :) this premixed one does not need cobalt - premixed na kasi. the gelcoat is not premixed however kaya kelangan ng cobalt.

as for the texture of the plug, just give it a good mirror finish and put release wax on it and it will be fine.

[bbn]

i assume UV inhibitor is needed to be applied on projects that are exposed to sunlight most of the time? pineprevent ba nito ang deterioration ng surface? pati ang sa inner part?

Yup that's right but I don't know if the UV penetrates and affects the interior. UV also affects epoxy which is why we put a top coat of polyurethane exterior varnish.

[JJCE]

ah ang iirc pala yun yung polyester resin? IC.. hehe
ok so meron na palang premixed polyester (di na kailangan ng hardener)

hmmm mirror finish? pano kung styrofoam ang mold ko? pwede kaya yung packeging tape? makintab yun e? dba pwedeng substitute ng release wax ang wax na pang kotse?

btw what do you mean by CSM and IIRC? sorry for the ignorance...

[spyghost]

ah ang iirc pala yun yung polyester resin? IC.. hehe
ok so meron na palang premixed polyester (di na kailangan ng hardener)

hmmm mirror finish? pano kung styrofoam ang mold ko? pwede kaya yung packeging tape? makintab yun e? dba pwedeng substitute ng release wax ang wax na pang kotse?

btw what do you mean by CSM and IIRC? sorry for the ignorance...

no no no, what i meant by premixed is that the resin comes premixed with the cobalt only. you just have to add the hardener.

csm = chop strand mat - the most comm
iirc = if i remember correctly :)

regarding the wax, yes a car wax will do narin. always double coat to ensure that all parts are coated.

if you plan to paint the styro with latex paint, which won't melt styro, patungan mo ng acrylic paint then buff to a showroom shine ika nga. this will make the inner portion of your project smooth and clean. medyo matagal talaga ang prep work ng gusto mo mold kasi from scratch ka.

if you are new to this, i suggest practice ka muna sa small things, else you'll end up spending more kasi ulit ka ng ulit.

i had a similar project just like yours which is in progress - fog lamp housing. aftermarket kasi ang ikakabit ko na fogs... oval shape sya and i want to make look like its oem (oem is round shape kasi). eto ang ikakabit ko orig na housing ng fogs.

i have the same mold which is an oval styro... ang ginawa ko is 2 pcs of 2" styro stuck back to back. painted it with latex and build up some thickness. to make the surface even, i used putty. for the mirror finish, just spray acrylic. wax ko is mothers step 3 paste wax... since that is what i have.

[JJCE]

oooops!! i thought cobalt accelerator was the hardener http://4x4ph.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/blush.gif

hmmm latex paint.. ayus din cguro to..

tama i should practice first in small things to master the whole procedure..merong maliit na bagay na pwede pagpraktisan dito. the cover of the seatbelt bolt on the bottom in one side was missing when we purchased it. but thank God the other at the opposite side was there. baka pwede yun gawin.. hehehe

if i'm not mistaken, ang gelcoat ang ginagamit to prevent "boiling" or escaping of the heat from the finished project, which eventually damages the paint job?

tia

[spyghost]

gelcoat is actually the finished surface of the fg material, may it be the mold, plug, or the final product.

freeform na muna pag-practisan mo... i suggest wheel chocks
http://www.belson.com/images/7074-M.jpg
http://www.belson.com/images/7074-dim.gif
http://www.discountramps.com/hdImages/fire-engine-wheel-chock-2.jpg
http://www.discountramps.com/hdImages/fire-engine-wheel-chock-3.jpg

[JJCE]

does the yellow one at the bottom serves a ramp for car? :confused: could it hold the car's weight?

so how do you prevent the escaping of hot air from the finished product? this is one of the problems with FGs..

[spyghost]

those are just chocks, not lifters = no load carrying

[bbn]

I was at Polymer today to get some fiberglass. I saw they have this product called "stryropatch" which if I understood correctly is applied to a styrofoam plug so the polyester resin won't melt it.

[spyghost]

I was at Polymer today to get some fiberglass. I saw they have this product called "stryropatch" which if I understood correctly is applied to a styrofoam plug so the polyester resin won't melt it.

iirc its styro-skin

[bbn]

You are right bro, thanks for correcting me.

[oakley]

guys, meron foam na pwede gamtin na fiberglass mold. yung expanding foam, nasa spray can yun. diko lang maalala kung same rin ba yun sa polyurethane expanding foam na nabasa ko somewhere or hindi. meron nyan sa ace.

paglabas nya sa can, parang whip cream tapos nagiging foam, parang foam ng kama. you can use a utility knife/cutter to cut it or, better yet, use an electric sander/grinder. then, to achieve a smooth surface, lagyan ng polyester body filler (masilya). polypatch brand yung ginamit ko frm polymer products. the cured expanding foam wont melt upon contact with either the filler or polyester resin.

actually, mas madali kung yung foam and filler combination ay gagawing plug (a.k.a. male mold) tapos gagawa ng isa pang mold, yung female naman, then the final product.

may nakita kasi ako dating demo sa tv, from polymer products din yata yun n video, ang ginamit nila yung foam na parang pang kama tapos nilagyan ng masilya para maging plug. hope this helps!

[freeman]

Wow, this is amazing. I was thinking of doing the same thing on a planned DIY kayak. Ano progress on your project yet?

[freeman]

Arent surfboards made this way? Can the same technique be used in making a kayak? Been contemplating on doing a DIY kayak.

[oakley]

have you seen the baby blue whale exhibit at glorietta 5? it's a fiberglass model of a 2 month old blue whale. the National Geographic Channel shows a short clip on how it was constructed. Its core consists of a white styrof0am-like material. I'm not exactly sure what the name of the material is. It's probably the same one used on surfboards. Then, the skin is made from fiberglass. You can even see on the clip how they lay out the chopped strand mats.

[freeman]

Yeah. I remember seeing that on TV. Is it structurally sound to be used as a kayak, or its only strong enough for static models.

[clayfigur]

just came to my mind this morning. pwede kaya ito? then i realized that the resin can melt the styrofoam just like the rugby does. pwede kayang lagyan ng foil, o tape kaya? nabasa ko din latex paint daw? uubra ba yun? haven't tried anything fiberglass but i already read some articles about it (including here and tsikot.com) then i thought it would be interesting ;D tia.

Yes, i tried it.. and it works perfect..

I used masking tape to cover the stryropore, then brushed it with wax (actually I only use clear floorwax, its cheaper) I waited till the resin is dry, then I split the mold from the finished fiber.

[john-jo]

Hi again Clayfigur!

You seem like a fairly well rounded DIY'er.
Very glad to see you sharing experiences, we learn so much from this site, thru friends and members.. Keep it up and thanks! :)